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August 6, 2015 12:41 am  #1


A question about Mycroft

I don't if this has ever been asked (and correct me if I'm wrong). So here it goes:

If Mycroft had to choose between his country or his brother, which would he choose? Would he sell out Sherlock if it were a matter of national security?

I know this is very much a "What If" scenario that may not ever happen but it would be interesting to hear your opinion about it.

 

August 6, 2015 1:53 am  #2


Re: A question about Mycroft

I think Mycroft, even though he claims not to be "given to outburst of brotherly compassion", would most definitely "choose" his little brother -Sherlock is, after all, Mycroft's pressure point.
In the event in which he'd have to choose between the security of the country (again, remember in ASiB when Irene says that she knows Mycroft won't lift a finger against her or he'd have to tell his bosses that "his biggest security leak is his own little brother"...and Mycroft ends up doing just that : not lifting a finger to protect his brother) and Sherlock, it seems rather obvious that he'd do everything he can to protect his family.
What's more...his (Sherlock's) loss would break his (Mycroft's) heart.

Throughout all three series we have been treated to how much Mycroft actually cares for Sherlock. In Series 1 it is admitedly creepy -kidnapping John Watson and trying to bribe him out of "concern". In Series 2 it becomes more apparent (again, the scene in the aircraft with Irene) until it just cannot be ignored in series 3 (TSoT he mentions "Redbeard" to try and help Sherlock prevent an emotional crisis, in HLV he tells Sherlock in so many words "Your loss would break my heart", and the look on his face after Sherlock shot Magnussen speaks volume).

Also, I would like to point out that, to me, when Sherlock tells Irene in ASiB that "this is your heart...never let it rule your head...sentiment is a chemical defect..." he is acknowledging the fact that Mycroft is right, and asking him for forgiveness -before saying it explicitly after he's cracked the password to her phone.

I'm sure there are other moments which could also be used to put emphasis on Mycroft's affection for his brother, but those are the only ones I can come up with at the moment.
 


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"It’s not a ‘gang’ show, it’s the Sherlock and John show. It’s about developing their characters and their relationship, and the characters drawn into their orbit.”  Steven Moffat



 
 

August 6, 2015 9:55 am  #3


Re: A question about Mycroft

I agree with Lily, I think it's clear how much Mycroft cares about Sherlock. And how far he is willing to go, and how much he will sacrfice, to protect him.


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August 6, 2015 10:20 am  #4


Re: A question about Mycroft

I hink that, too. He would choose Sherlock. This "it would break my heart" if something bad would happen to Sherlock says it all. Even if he was slightly tipsy while saying that, drunk people tell the truth.


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Normal is not something to aspire to, it's something to get away from!


 
 

August 6, 2015 10:43 am  #5


Re: A question about Mycroft

Yes, valid point, Ivy. But somehow I can't picture Mycroft "tipsy"...? It's not like he never ever drinks alcohol, is it? Granted, we only see him do so in times of crisis (e.g. ASiB, Moriarty's text), but that doesn't mean he never drinks.
Depending on how many drinks of punch he'd had, his leash on his emotion must have been somewhat loosened, though and indicating his inebriation is a good point.
However, I disagree with the wording you used : "drunk people tell the truth". "Tipsy" and "drunk" are very different states of drunkenness. When someone is tipsy, they're only slightly drunk. When someone is drunk, however...It's not necessary that all hell breaks loose, but they stop caring (they'll do stupid things for the fun of it, for example). I'm just pointing it out, eh, I think you've made a fair point here.
Please don't take my comment the wrong way...
 


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I'd be lost without my blogger.
"It’s not a ‘gang’ show, it’s the Sherlock and John show. It’s about developing their characters and their relationship, and the characters drawn into their orbit.”  Steven Moffat



 
 

August 6, 2015 12:00 pm  #6


Re: A question about Mycroft

When Sherlock was faced with a similar "Sophie´s choice" in TRF (committing suicide or letting his friends killed), he invented a third way, a way out of this wretched situation.

I imagine that Mycroft too would rather invent some new situation or a strange compromise, rather than sacrifice either Sherlock or his country....


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I cannot live without brainwork. What else is there to live for? Stand at the window there. Was there ever such a dreary, dismal, unprofitable world? See how the yellow fog swirls down the street and drifts across the dun-coloured houses. What could be more hopelessly prosaic and material? What is the use of having powers, Doctor, when one has no field upon which to exert them?

 

August 6, 2015 12:19 pm  #7


Re: A question about Mycroft

Don't worry Lilythiell.  This "slightly tipsy" was meant slightly ironical. I know the difference between tipsy and drunk. I just wanted to say that alcohol loosens your tongue (and it really depends on the person at what level of drunkenness the tongue is loose)

Mycroft was not drunk, I reckon he is too smart for binge drinking. But I can picture him being tipsy, and I would love to see that, by the way.
That sentence "it would break my heart" was an emotional outburst that may have different reasons. Although I don't think Sherlock believes him, or he doesn't want to believe him, his hatred for Mycroft is very childish, so I guess deep inside him (very deep) he feels the same way like Mycroft.


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Normal is not something to aspire to, it's something to get away from!


 
 

August 6, 2015 12:20 pm  #8


Re: A question about Mycroft

Yes, but if he had absolutely no choice, and couldn't engineer a third option, which would be the most likely, in your opinion?

Edited because it was really not English. Ugh. Sorry about that.

Last edited by Lilythiell (August 6, 2015 12:33 pm)


-------------------------------------------------------------------------
I'd be lost without my blogger.
"It’s not a ‘gang’ show, it’s the Sherlock and John show. It’s about developing their characters and their relationship, and the characters drawn into their orbit.”  Steven Moffat



 
 

August 6, 2015 12:31 pm  #9


Re: A question about Mycroft

Lilythiell wrote:

Yes, but if he had absolutely no choice, and couldn't engineer a third option, which would it be the more likely, in your opinion?

Hmmm, I am inclined to think that Mycroft would choose Sherlock in most cases and only an imminent destruction of some part of the country would force him to sell Sherlock out....
 


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I cannot live without brainwork. What else is there to live for? Stand at the window there. Was there ever such a dreary, dismal, unprofitable world? See how the yellow fog swirls down the street and drifts across the dun-coloured houses. What could be more hopelessly prosaic and material? What is the use of having powers, Doctor, when one has no field upon which to exert them?

 

August 6, 2015 12:37 pm  #10


Re: A question about Mycroft

I always understood the "Your loss would break my heart" came from the spiked punch. Not the alcohol, but the drug Sherlock (or Billy) put in it. So I've never taken that sentence at face value, I don't know if he said it because he actually means it, or if it was just the drug talking.


__________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
"We'll live on starlight and crime scenes" - wordstrings


Team Hudders!
 
 

August 6, 2015 12:41 pm  #11


Re: A question about Mycroft

But the drug the punch had been spiced with is meant to have people suddenly pass out, isn't it? Look at what happens to Mary, for example?
I don't think that anything Mummy/Dad/Mycroft and Mary said between the moment they'd taken the punch (or the tea, because presumably it's the same drug) would be drug induced.
 


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I'd be lost without my blogger.
"It’s not a ‘gang’ show, it’s the Sherlock and John show. It’s about developing their characters and their relationship, and the characters drawn into their orbit.”  Steven Moffat



 
 

August 6, 2015 1:05 pm  #12


Re: A question about Mycroft

Vhanja wrote:

I always understood the "Your loss would break my heart" came from the spiked punch. Not the alcohol, but the drug Sherlock (or Billy) put in it. So I've never taken that sentence at face value, I don't know if he said it because he actually means it, or if it was just the drug talking.

In vino veritas / in oino aletheia / in wine there´s truth.

If it was a drugged punch speaking, then I think Mycroft meant every word and the punch just loosened his inhibitions to admit the truth to Sherlock.
 


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I cannot live without brainwork. What else is there to live for? Stand at the window there. Was there ever such a dreary, dismal, unprofitable world? See how the yellow fog swirls down the street and drifts across the dun-coloured houses. What could be more hopelessly prosaic and material? What is the use of having powers, Doctor, when one has no field upon which to exert them?

 

August 6, 2015 4:02 pm  #13


Re: A question about Mycroft

There is truth in vine (but not always), but not sure if there's necessarily truth in drugs. A lot of drugs just make you ramble. 


__________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
"We'll live on starlight and crime scenes" - wordstrings


Team Hudders!
 
 

August 7, 2015 1:46 pm  #14


Re: A question about Mycroft

I also definitely agree that he would choose Sherlock. I don't think there would be anything more important than him.

And as for the comment at Christmas - I took the remark about the punch to be kind of like 'joke' to make light on the fact that Mycroft had just confessed his feelings to Sherlock (which he doesn't do, especially so explicitly)

Also, of course, it was Mofftiss setting up the following scene, to drive it home for us that Mycroft really would do anything for Sherlock (which is secretly why I hope Mycroft will go apeshit on Mary at some point for what she did to him ;p )

 

August 7, 2015 1:54 pm  #15


Re: A question about Mycroft

And Mummy will help, too "Someone put a bullet in my boy and if I ever find out who I shall turn absolutely monstruous"
...though I suspect Mycroft will have more ways to do just that. Insiduous ways.
 


-------------------------------------------------------------------------
I'd be lost without my blogger.
"It’s not a ‘gang’ show, it’s the Sherlock and John show. It’s about developing their characters and their relationship, and the characters drawn into their orbit.”  Steven Moffat



 
 

August 25, 2015 8:53 pm  #16


Re: A question about Mycroft

I have my own question regarding Mycroft.  I think we all agree that he cares deeply for his little brother, their sibling rivalry notwithstanding.  But I wonder--does he also care for John?  Obviously, he doesn't have the same kind of relationship with John--they're not brothers, and he doesn't even make John's acquaintance until John has met Sherlock in "A Study in Pink."  But do you suppose that in the course of the TV series, Mycroft comes to care for his brother's flatmate, or does he simply see John, from start to finish, as a means to an end (mainly, watching after Sherlock)?
 

Last edited by kgreen20 (August 25, 2015 8:55 pm)

 

August 25, 2015 8:57 pm  #17


Re: A question about Mycroft

I think it is more than just have him watching over Sherlock. He knows that his brother is a difficult person to be around and appreciates that John likes and protects Sherlock. They work together as we can see from ASiB and HLV. 


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"To fake the death of one sibling may be regarded as a misfortune; to fake the death of both looks like carelessness." Oscar Wilde about Mycroft Holmes

"It is what it is says love." (Erich Fried)

“Enjoy the journey of life and not just the endgame. I’m also a great believer in treating others as you would like to be treated.” (Benedict Cumberbatch)



 
 

August 25, 2015 9:01 pm  #18


Re: A question about Mycroft

Yes, I'm sure he does appreciate that.  But does Mycroft, I wonder, ever come to care for John in his own right, as opposed to simply appreciating how well he works with Sherlock and looks after him?  We all know that he worries about Sherlock--do you suppose that he ever begins to worry about John, as well?

(Hey, there's an idea for a fanfic!)

 

Last edited by kgreen20 (August 25, 2015 9:09 pm)

 

August 25, 2015 9:13 pm  #19


Re: A question about Mycroft

Interesting point I have not thought about. But I assume that Mycroft would only care for John as Sherlock's friend. He does not seem to care for other people in general, Sherlock is an exception. 


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"To fake the death of one sibling may be regarded as a misfortune; to fake the death of both looks like carelessness." Oscar Wilde about Mycroft Holmes

"It is what it is says love." (Erich Fried)

“Enjoy the journey of life and not just the endgame. I’m also a great believer in treating others as you would like to be treated.” (Benedict Cumberbatch)



 
 

August 25, 2015 9:43 pm  #20


Re: A question about Mycroft

I agree with Susi, I think Mycroft cares for John in the way that John does what Mycroft is prevented to do: take care of Sherlock. I think he is thankful for Johns presents at Sherlock’s side, for the fact that he has someone he can trust who has as much an interest as Mycroft himself in keeping Sherlock safe. But I don’t think he cares too much for John on his own. His dismissive comments about meeting up with him “for fish and chips” and his sneering at Sherlock’s “friends” point to him not being terribly interested in John himself. To Mycroft, John must seem like a perfect goldfish, albeit a helpful one.


As for the original question. I think in the end Mycroft would choose Sherlock over his country. I think it has been made clear that his baby brother is the one weak spot Mycroft has; he has been attracted through Sherlock repeatedly and yet he cannot bring himself to distance himself from Sherlock.
 


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We balance probabilities and choose the most likely. It is the scientific use of the imagination.    
 

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