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March 14, 2014 10:46 pm  #41

Re: Will the kid die too?

Yeah, but that's boring.   


"After all this time?" "Always."
Good bye, Lord Rickman of the Alan

March 15, 2014 4:40 pm  #42

Re: Will the kid die too?

I think it would be easier if the Mary's pregnancy was a fake. I don't think they'll kill the baby or Mary (basically everybody is fed up with a grieving John, and anyway, Sherlock BBC is not Game of Thrones).

And please, no cheating Mary, it sounds so cheap... like a sitcom. Anyway in this case John would consider the child like his. I don't see him rejecting the child and saying "Well, the baby is not mine, get out Mary".

But Moftiss have to get rid of the baby. I don't want to see a Mary feeding a baby while John and Sherlock are happily arresting bad guys. It's acceptable in ACD because it was Victorian time, but in a modern TV show (about a modern Sherlock), it's just ridiculous. 

I'm kind of dubious with Mary's character, but I wait to see how Moftiss will deal with it. But in any case, please, no child! I don't want to watch Sherlock becoming a sort of The Big Bang Theory.

Last edited by Ozymandias (March 15, 2014 4:41 pm)

"Storming, enjoying, planning, loving, cautioning,
Backing and filling, appearing and disappearing,
I tread day and night such roads."
Walt Whitman


March 15, 2014 4:56 pm  #43

Re: Will the kid die too?

Hm, I don't know. It would be easy, but twisting? Interesting? Exciting for the show? And more intriguing: is it plausible? I don't really think so. Sherlock surprised everyone including the mother to be by deducing the signs of pregnancy she showed. It was not Mary following some dark implications and announcing pregnancy for her purposes. My wise prediction for now is they both stay. I just hope really decent in the background and we can restore balance to the galaxy again!


Eventually everyone will support Johnlock.

"If you're not reading the subtext then hell mend you"  -  Steven Moffat
"Love conquers all" Benedict Cumberbatch on Sherlock's and John's relationship
"This is a show about a detective, his best friend, his wife, their baby and their dog" - Nobody. Ever.

March 15, 2014 5:06 pm  #44

Re: Will the kid die too?

Why not? When Sherlock deduced the signs of pregnancy, Mary was just at the beginning of the pregnancy. They went on honeymoon, they came back, the Magnusson thing happens (when she shot Sherlock, her belly wasn't really swollen). Then comes the Watsons argument. We can suppose that John came back in 221B until Christmas, when he apparently decided to forget Mary. So he never see Mary naked with a huge belly. 

I don't say it would be a great plot, but it would be logical (and less heart-breaking/ordinary than a miscarriage and/or the death of Mary and/or the baby). I really don't think Moftiss are going to put a baby, it would entirely change the dynamic of the show. 

"Storming, enjoying, planning, loving, cautioning,
Backing and filling, appearing and disappearing,
I tread day and night such roads."
Walt Whitman


March 15, 2014 9:29 pm  #45

Re: Will the kid die too?

Honestly, I think the part with the horns was simply a joke to underline that she just manipulated the boys into going on a case. It's not like the writers specifically hung up the decoration so that it could work as horns later on, it was just conveniently there.

And why should Mary pretend to be pregnant? She has no reason to do so and every reason not to.

I also don't understand the insistence that the marriage isn't valid. Does it really matter? Certainly not for the relationship in itself.


March 19, 2014 6:36 pm  #46

Re: Will the kid die too?

The show Dexter actually *did* work with Harrison, his baby son. 

Interesting: Dexter was a vigillante serial killer-- so, one of the good guys, sort of. His wife Rita, and the mother of his son,  is murdered by another serial killer Dexter has been hunting. It's retaliation.  

He finds another serial killer (by the next to last season) and in the very last season plans to run off taking Harrison, and the serial killer girlfriend, Hannah. 

Hannah does try to kill Dexter's sister--- and it's all about protecting her past, future, etc, .This causes a huge rift between Deb and Dexter.  In the end, Deb forgives Hannah, and even helps them.

I am seeing some similarities here; so, yes-- I think having mom and baby could work; but like Dexter, I don't think for long. Dexter indirectly gets his sister killed; and in his grief, fakes his own death, leaving Hannah and Harrison together in Venezuela, while he goes into exile. 

He has come to the realization that because he is who he is-- he will always endanger those he loves.

Perhaps Mary comes to beleive the same? 

Looking at that model you could have John, now alone because Mary has gone into exile-- still working with Sherlock: Maybe they go into business as partners, so John gives up his practice (canon) and they can actually afford a nanny. (Which was a plot device in Dexter, actually) 

This isn't the direction I'd opt for; but I do think it's plausible.


April 6, 2014 10:58 pm  #47

Re: Will the kid die too?

Hm... very good points. 

I have never thought of the theory that Mary would of been cheating on John... its a great twist.. and I could almost see Moftiss doing it. 

Especially because we never really see anything happening between John and Mary.

But latching onto some previous theories about what will happen with a baby in 221B:
-Okay, I highly doubt that the baby will be taken away by either
--social services
-- a miscarrage is an idea, but we have to think- Moftiss made Mary have a baby for a reason. Would they just kill it off like that- just for the grief of the audience? It seems too artificial for me. 
-Maybe Mary will raise the baby at her flat?
-Maybe the baby will suffer some kind of ailment (blindness, deafness, paralysis, etc.) and have to be kept at a special home?
-Maybe, even though I'm contradicting myself, Social Services WILL come, and take the baby away?

Anyway. I do not think that having a baby in the show will completely ruin it. Moftiss is probably thinking very hard about this circumstance. THEY MUST HAVE A REASON FOR MAKING MARY PREGNANT. We now just have to figure out what it is. Then, we can figure out if it will live or die, stay or go, or be affected by Sherlock/John's weirdness. 

It would be cool to see the baby grow up throughout further seasons, maybe becoming a kind of "friend" to Sherlock.

"In 900 years of time and space, I've never met anyone who wasnt important" -Eleventh Doctor 

"Sentiment is a chemical defect found in the losing side" -Sherlock

April 7, 2014 7:51 am  #48

Re: Will the kid die too?

Sorry, I just don't see any hint that Mary cheated on John. Actually I would leave that one out as highly improbable.
- Mary raising the child in all peace at home could work, bit boring, bit of  "Amanda and Martin-their story", but anyway. Rather have another great supporting character than three and a half leads.
- I agree that misscarriage would give away anything the writers built. No sense there.
- same for me with a seriously ill child that has to live in a special home. What would it give to the show?
I have to disagree that baby Harrison in "Dexter" did work. Well it worked in not completely ruining the show, but I never saw that he enrichened it. I love children very much and Harrison was truly adorable. But was it necessary for the show? Not in my opinion.
With Dexter I loved that Jennifer and Michael were not the love interests but the siblings. They did a great job. And I adored Rita very much and missed her after she was killed.


Eventually everyone will support Johnlock.

"If you're not reading the subtext then hell mend you"  -  Steven Moffat
"Love conquers all" Benedict Cumberbatch on Sherlock's and John's relationship
"This is a show about a detective, his best friend, his wife, their baby and their dog" - Nobody. Ever.

April 7, 2014 9:30 am  #49

Re: Will the kid die too?

Baby-Watson and Sherlock's pet dog are imo just a device to make the audience drown in emotions to prevent them from thinking.
Kids and animals are often used when authors are out of their depths and don't know how to go on.
It's poor writing style. I don't believe in pets and babies without any purpose. Doyle made use of animals only for crime solving purposes. Take the dog in the Vampire case where the dog gave a clue. The baby was the victim.
Doyle used dogs to help Holmes to chase after criminals. But that's it.

When we get a pet dog, a baby, a wedding with hugging and kissing, declarations of love, Sherlock folding serviettes, sooo sweet music that it hurts, we should ask ourselves immediately "What's going on?" 
I am not an expert in music in any way but this wedding composition of Sherlock's is really awful. Well done!



April 7, 2014 9:42 am  #50

Re: Will the kid die too?

I disagree with you where the dog is concerned. For me it has the function of showing that Sherlock just suppressed his emotions which had been there all along and that in his past he had problems in adjusting his feelings and his mind. Therefore Mycroft taught him how to distance himself from his feelings and learn to rely on his brain instead. The dog gives us a glimpse into his childhood. This is at least how I saw it but then I am quite immune against getting emotional about dogs.

I remember very well the discussion on this board if Sherlock had any feelings at all so we should not discount this as self-evident. 

"To fake the death of one sibling may be regarded as a misfortune; to fake the death of both looks like carelessness." Oscar Wilde about Mycroft Holmes

"It is what it is says love." (Erich Fried)

“Enjoy the journey of life and not just the endgame. I’m also a great believer in treating others as you would like to be treated.” (Benedict Cumberbatch)


April 7, 2014 9:58 am  #51

Re: Will the kid die too?

I understand why the dog is there plotwise. It's how the audience imagines Sherlock's emotional state of mind. One of emotional repression and self-denial. I just don't see it like that.
I tried to draw people's attention to the exceptionally overuse of sentimental elements in Series 3. Futile. Obviously. Won't try that again.


April 7, 2014 2:48 pm  #52

Re: Will the kid die too?

What if Moriarty kills her?
Or he has anything to do with her because of her shock at the end of season 3?
Also I find that she looked quite shocked after Sherlock told her she was pregnant... maybe John not the father?

It feels squishy! Is it supposed to feel squishy?
You’ve salted away every fact under the sun!

April 27, 2014 3:14 pm  #53

Re: Will the kid die too?

Maybe John only fires blanks. (No viable sperm, low sperm count, etc.) Neither of them knew this. But Mary could have figured out that something was amiss after a certain amount of being together with John. Maybe Mary was desperate to have a baby and either used the turkey baster method herself, or asked a friend to do her a favor.  Someone upthread mentioned the incident of the Mary's ex-boyfriend  being cool towards Mary at the wedding. Of course this fellow had been warned off by Sherlock and placed "on warning" during the wedding preparation phase.

Does Sherlock  have suspicions? We'll see.


September 1, 2014 5:26 pm  #54

Re: Will the kid die too?

Moriarty did promise to burn the heart out of Sherlock...
I like the way Moffatt used the word, "devastating", for Season 4!
I like Zeratul's previous theory regarding Moriarty's involvement with this too.
Addicted to this drama!  Mwah!


September 4, 2014 11:05 pm  #55

Re: Will the kid die too?

I think little Shezza Watson will be safe. The marriage between Mary and John might not be. Sherlock had said that Mary was posibly "not originally English" and that she was "running from something.
I hope the CIA goons (including the one Sherlock threw out the window) are not involved.
As a Merkin, I find it tiresome when Brit TV brings out the CIA goons. They are the Hamburger Helper (a Merkin meal extender) of brit drama. But playing CIA goons provide jobs for actors so I guess some good comes of using this plot device.

Don't get me wrong - Brit TV rocks. The British do everything better than us Merkins. Mostly.


September 4, 2014 11:14 pm  #56

Re: Will the kid die too?

Arabella Trefoil wrote:

I think little Shezza Watson will be safe.

I don't care what they end up calling her for real, from now on, she's going to be Shezza to me.


John: That's clever. So you scratch their backs and...
Sherlock: Yes. And then disinfect myself.

September 5, 2014 12:12 am  #57

Re: Will the kid die too?

I think we ought to throw Shezza Watson a baby shower.


September 5, 2014 5:58 am  #58

Re: Will the kid die too?



September 5, 2014 9:20 am  #59

Re: Will the kid die too?

Nice name for a little girl. Billy ("The Wig") can be Shezza's godfather.


September 5, 2014 11:28 am  #60

Re: Will the kid die too?



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