BBC Sherlock Fan Forum - Serving Sherlockians since February 2012.


You are not logged in. Would you like to login or register?



February 23, 2014 10:11 pm  #21


Re: My thoughts about Mary (all episodes)

RavenMorganLeigh wrote:

SusiGo wrote:

I agree with you, Raven. The fun has gone a bit short during the last weeks. http://cdn.boardhost.com/emoticons/wink.png
 
I think it is due to the nature of series 3 that there is so much discussion about the characters and the directions they take. Which is fine because this makes Sherlock interesting. I only criticise the way it is sometimes discusssed, not the discussion as such. 
P.S. I am no friend of polyamory either. 

Heh. Here's the funny thing about that story-- I don;t actually have anything against polyamory perse-- but in my story I made clear that I didn't think it would work for Sherlock; and that it would be kind of cruel to suggest it to him. And I confess that I am absolutley *not* inclined to the lifestyle, myself. 

But it's looking at the actual events and characterization in season 3 that intrigues me, and actually I find the mixed messages with the way  Mary is portrayed just...baffling. On the other hand, if she's an actual psychopath, one of the things she would be skilled at doing is charming people into liking her, sort of "the wolf in sheep's clothing" approach to all of her relationships. 

What I find amusing is that both Moriarty (or rather his spectre inhabiting Sherlock′s head) and CAM – who are rather repulsive individuals themselves – find Mary to be a reaaaaally bad piece of work. She must be incredibly nasty in her real form if she scares even the kings of crime with her past deeds.
 
(But I must say I find this „assassin Mary“ character much more interesting than „John′s sassy and nosy wife Mary“ character she was in TEH and TSOT. On the other hand, I suspected from the very start that her nice behaviour is just an act...)
 
Couldn′t agree more on that „wolf in sheep′s clothing“, through.


-----------------------------------

I cannot live without brainwork. What else is there to live for? Stand at the window there. Was there ever such a dreary, dismal, unprofitable world? See how the yellow fog swirls down the street and drifts across the dun-coloured houses. What could be more hopelessly prosaic and material? What is the use of having powers, Doctor, when one has no field upon which to exert them?

http://49.media.tumblr.com/eb0e156f55878fcd6f89dcf91ae89811/tumblr_o0eyyzrphE1spvwrzo2_1280.gif
 

February 23, 2014 10:11 pm  #22


Re: My thoughts about Mary (all episodes)

Swanpride wrote:

. It's in my eyes no longer a discussion about her character, it has become more and more just bashing. "Let's see what else we can find to prove that she is unworthy of Sherlock sacrifice".

No, I don't think so. Sherlock's sacrifice isn't meant for Mary, but in the long run, like Susi said, for John. Remember mind palace Moriarty's "John Watson is definitely in danger", not "Mary is in danger".


 


---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
John: "Have you spoken to Mycroft, Molly, uh, anyone?"
Mrs Hudson: "They don’t matter. You do."


I BELIEVE IN SERIES 5!
http://up.picr.de/25572077rl.jpg



                                                                                                                  
 

February 23, 2014 10:14 pm  #23


Re: My thoughts about Mary (all episodes)

Swanpride wrote:

Well, why should she die for Sherlock? She only knows him for less than a year. She isn't in love with him. And I bet, she would risk her life for him - but not the life of her unborn child and her marriage.

 

Sherlock has sacrificed his entire future for her safety because he knows it is best for John.  He barely knows her... and she shot him in the chest.  But he does this incredibly selfless thing.

She knows what Sherlock means to John, and shoots him to avoid unpleasantness between her and John.  (I don't think she believes not shooting Sherlock will kill John - just that it will ruin her relationship with him.)

Sure, the baby makes a big difference.  I just don't think she's as selfless as John and Sherlock are.  Not bashing her - just telling it like I see it.

Maybe (and I really hope so) she'll do something incredibly selfless next season.  (I can't honestly think anything but they'll have to remove her - and making her be the Big Bad is so incredibly damaging to John.  I'd much rather she be a last-minute heroine.)

Fillyjonk

Last edited by Fillyjonk (February 23, 2014 10:16 pm)


Check my Tumblr for a musical tribute to Sherlock's devotion during series 3.
http://imtooticky.tumblr.com
 

February 23, 2014 10:16 pm  #24


Re: My thoughts about Mary (all episodes)

RavenMorganLeigh wrote:

But...erm, the character Mary is a creation of the writers. That means she is what they wanted her to be. She can't independently up and decide to be a great person and then be mad that the writers didn't portray her that way... she is the way she is because the writers wrote her that way, and that is what fans are responding to. http://cdn.boardhost.com/emoticons/confused.png
 So, I don't quite understand what you mean...

I don't understand how you can't understand what I said there. I know she is a creation of the writers. No where did I say that this character is magically this. What I said in my post was that I believe the writers made a mistake in not showing us moments of geniune affection from John and Mary, especially the wedding scenes. 

The writers seem to tell us Mary loves John and John loves Mary. I just wish we were shown more rather than told. That's all.

@Swanpride: Oh yeah! XD I know it is cliche and yes, those moments were great. I guess I wanted to see more. 
 

Last edited by LoveIsAViciousMotivator (February 23, 2014 10:18 pm)

 

February 23, 2014 10:17 pm  #25


Re: My thoughts about Mary (all episodes)

@ Ani: I agree. We must keep in mind that it is Sherlock and not an imaginary Moriarty speaking. It is Sherlock thinking "That wife!" And he thinks it in the most crucial moment of his life (or death) so it must be important. 
I actually started writing all this because I simply cannot believe Sherlock's explanation in Baker Street. I felt totally unwell with this and tried to find out if there is a reason for his saying these things to John. 

Last edited by SusiGo (February 23, 2014 10:18 pm)


------------------------------
"To fake the death of one sibling may be regarded as a misfortune; to fake the death of both looks like carelessness." Oscar Wilde about Mycroft Holmes

"It is what it is says love." (Erich Fried)

“Enjoy the journey of life and not just the endgame. I’m also a great believer in treating others as you would like to be treated.” (Benedict Cumberbatch)

http://up.picr.de/28609194so.png

 
     Thread Starter
 

February 23, 2014 10:23 pm  #26


Re: My thoughts about Mary (all episodes)

LoveIsAViciousMotivator wrote:

RavenMorganLeigh wrote:

But...erm, the character Mary is a creation of the writers. That means she is what they wanted her to be. She can't independently up and decide to be a great person and then be mad that the writers didn't portray her that way... she is the way she is because the writers wrote her that way, and that is what fans are responding to. http://cdn.boardhost.com/emoticons/confused.png
 So, I don't quite understand what you mean...

I don't understand how you can't understand what I said there. I know she is a creation of the writers. No where did I say that this character is magically this. What I said in my post was that I believe the writers made a mistake in not showing us moments of geniune affection from John and Mary, especially the wedding scenes. 

The writers seem to tell us Mary loves John and John loves Mary. I just wish we were shown more rather than told. That's all.

But maybe this is exactly the point...? They seem to tell us something, but by not showing us certain things, they might deliberatly keep some things ambiguous - just like in TSoT. There is a wedding going on, but we don't see all that much of the happy couple... we see a lot more of the 'other couple', if you know what I mean. http://cdn.boardhost.com/emoticons/wink.png


 

Last edited by SolarSystem (February 23, 2014 10:24 pm)


___________________________________________________
"Am I the current King of England?"
http://picload.org/image/wcodogr/jungssignatur.jpg

"I see no shame in having an unhealthy obsession with something." - David Tennant
"We did observe." - David Tennant in "Richard II"

 
 

February 23, 2014 10:26 pm  #27


Re: My thoughts about Mary (all episodes)

Dream Moriarty says that John is in danger and then says "that wife". He never says that John is in danger from Mary...so he can just as well mean that he is in danger because of Mary (she has enemies after all). And I'm convinced that the writer deliberately word it this way and let Mary act suspiciously so that the audience will be surprised when it turns out that she didn't really try to kill Sherlock.

 

February 23, 2014 10:28 pm  #28


Re: My thoughts about Mary (all episodes)

SusiGo wrote:

@ Ani: I agree. We must keep in mind that it is Sherlock and not an imaginary Moriarty speaking. It is Sherlock thinking "That wife!" And he thinks it in the most crucial moment of his life (or death) so it must be important. 
I actually started writing all this because I simply cannot believe Sherlock's explanation in Baker Street. I felt totally unwell with this and tried to find out if there is a reason for his saying these things to John. 

That whole scene contradicts Sherlock's assertion that Mary tried to save his life: I mean, an awful lot of that was instruction in how Not To Die from the gunshot wound delivered via Mary. And, yeah-- CAM going on about how "wicked" Mary is, and that she went 'freelance", rogue-- "so many dead bodies", That doesn't help Mary's case.

And Cam referring to John and Mary as "Mr. and Mrs. Psychopath"-- sort of like when men will demean another man by calling him "Mr. The wife or girlfreind's last name meaning that the guy is whipped. That doesn't help either, it tells me that at least CAM thinks that John is married to someone very, very dangerous. 

Moriarty seems to represent Sherlock's fear, and his fear of emotional pain. But Moriarty was also a genius, and that part of Sherlock is telling him that Mary is dangerous, and John's life is in danger... from her. 

Last edited by RavenMorganLeigh (February 23, 2014 10:29 pm)

 

February 23, 2014 10:34 pm  #29


Re: My thoughts about Mary (all episodes)

There may be several ways to interpret Moriarty's words but my reading is that Sherlock is warning himself not to leave John alone with his wife. I have tried to see Mary in a different light and to believe Sherlock when he says that she is right for John but I simply could not. It does not work for me, not  based on what we get in series 3.


------------------------------
"To fake the death of one sibling may be regarded as a misfortune; to fake the death of both looks like carelessness." Oscar Wilde about Mycroft Holmes

"It is what it is says love." (Erich Fried)

“Enjoy the journey of life and not just the endgame. I’m also a great believer in treating others as you would like to be treated.” (Benedict Cumberbatch)

http://up.picr.de/28609194so.png

 
     Thread Starter
 

February 23, 2014 10:38 pm  #30


Re: My thoughts about Mary (all episodes)

SolarSystem wrote:

But maybe this is exactly the point...? They seem to tell us something, but by not showing us certain things, they might deliberatly keep some things ambiguous - just like in TSoT. There is a wedding going on, but we don't see all that much of the happy couple... we see a lot more of the 'other couple', if you know what I mean. http://cdn.boardhost.com/emoticons/wink.png
 

I love ambiguity in Mary's past, but I think the writers really want us to know she does indeed love John. I see it and it seems Sherlock does too. Maybe I just have  alittle problem with execution, but that's just me so that's thats. XD

LOL I know what you mean! Sherlock and John! At least, we know they love each other. XD Even if John is always shocked that Sherlock comes to his rescue every now and then. Get a clue, John! XDD


 

Last edited by LoveIsAViciousMotivator (February 23, 2014 10:39 pm)

 

February 23, 2014 10:40 pm  #31


Re: My thoughts about Mary (all episodes)

SusiGo

Food for thought indeed; I have commented before that I thought it strange that she didn't dive into the bonfire alongside Sherlock to haul John out but I hadn't thought to analyse that dialogue in the way that you have. Now that you point it out I must confess that it is very strange; most people would not remain in a bonfire, doused with petrol and about to be set on fire, if they had any choice in the matter; urging them to extract themselves seems exceedingly odd. I had hitherto construed it as evidence that her apparent devotion did not extend to actually risking being burned, but the lines themselves have an artificial air; it's as if she's trying to sound as if she's helping him whilst not actually helping him.

If we rerun the restaurant scene without the soft focus lighting, the soft focus hairstyle and the vintage dress, and had Mary speak the lines in the tone she adopts once she's been outed, then I think your point about the dialogue would become obvious; kudos to you for spotting it in the camouflage, as it were.

So we are left with a Mary who never says 'I love you', never risks herself for John, is prepared to shoot Sherlock on more than one occasion, and has been left alive by CAM for reasons which completely elude me unless there is a previous connection between them which tips the scales against having her taken out.

I am puzzled that discussing a fictional character in a tv series, even one as dramatic as Sherlock, should generate such passions; I suppose one could argue that it's a tribute to Moftiss' abilities as writers that it has. But I do feel that much of the passion is not actually about the show itself; it seems that, to a certain extent, the show has become a vehicle for arguments which have nothing to do with what is on screen. I don't believe that the writers thought that people would construe it as polyamory, they are aware of the JohnLock but don't believe that what they write is JohnLock.

They deliberately finished the shooting of the first two episodes before giving the actors the script for HLV; they had, up until that point, encouraged people to believe that Mary was, indeed, a Mary Sue. Good writers don't write Mary Sues; if you come across a Mary Sue character it is a very obvious signal that something is wrong somewhere, and, being Moftiss, of course it is horribly wrong. It is pretty unlikely that they accidentally omitted  Mary saying 'I love you', just as it is pretty unlikely that it never occurred to them that urging John to remove himself from the bonfire was distinctly strange.

Of course, I hadn't noticed that before you pointed it out

 

February 23, 2014 10:49 pm  #32


Re: My thoughts about Mary (all episodes)

LoveIsAViciousMotivator wrote:

SolarSystem wrote:

But maybe this is exactly the point...? They seem to tell us something, but by not showing us certain things, they might deliberatly keep some things ambiguous - just like in TSoT. There is a wedding going on, but we don't see all that much of the happy couple... we see a lot more of the 'other couple', if you know what I mean. http://cdn.boardhost.com/emoticons/wink.png
 

I love ambiguity in Mary's past, but I think the writers really want us to know she does indeed love John. I see it and it seems Sherlock does too. Maybe I just have  alittle problem with execution, but that's just me so that's thats. XD

LOL I know what you mean! Sherlock and John! At least, we know they love each other. XD Even if John is always shocked that Sherlock comes to his rescue every now and then. Get a clue, John! XDD


 

I actually have no doubt that Mary loves John-- not at all. But I think her love is toxic, because it doesn't put his needs first. Of all people, she knows what Sherlock's death would do to John; we see her holding hands with John at Sherlock's grave at the start of series 3. John is still grieving. She shoots Sherlock anyway, even knowing what kind of pain that will put him in-- and it's to "protect her relationship." 

She knows exactly how John views lies and betrayal-- and she does it anyway-- "to protect her relationship." She even knows that "It would break John", and she has no problem living that lie-- until Sherlock traps her into outing herself. 

If a man did this to his wife, we'd have absolutely no problem describing the man's actions as wrong, abusive, sinister, controlling, pathalogical. I'm just sayin'. :-)

 

 

February 23, 2014 11:08 pm  #33


Re: My thoughts about Mary (all episodes)

RavenMorganLeigh wrote:

If a man did this to his wife, we'd have absolutely no problem describing the man's actions as wrong, abusive, sinister, controlling, pathalogical. I'm just sayin'. :-) 

Mary loves John. Can it be seen as possessive? Yes. Dangerous? Yes. But wasn't Sherlock a bit possessive of John too? Dangerous? And Sherlock loves John too. =)

It's not perfect, but I don't see Mary as abusive, sinister, nor controlling. I see Mary as a woman who is trying to escape her past as a professional killer to led an ordinary life for a man she has come to love. Would it hold? That's for the writers' to decide in S4.

 

Last edited by LoveIsAViciousMotivator (February 23, 2014 11:10 pm)

 

February 23, 2014 11:09 pm  #34


Re: My thoughts about Mary (all episodes)

I also feel that her character is quite complex and that's what I enjoy about her. I love the character of Mary; not because I think she's a good person but I think she's a very human person. I think the writers have done a brilliant job of creating a character that has multiple motivations (as most people do); who is carrying around baggage from a difficult past and is making decisions based on that baggage (as most people do). She's not a caricature or a stereotype and I personally think that's brilliant.

Some people have expressed the view that they felt betrayed by Moftiss and Mary's character because they were "made to love her" in the first two episodes only to learn that she's "not who they thought she was" in episode three. I love that fact. I think it is a beautiful demonstration that people are not two dimensional and that people make mistakes. I agree that most of her motivations are selfish - but without knowing exactly what has happened in her past, it's impossible to make any kind of judgements as to whether that is justified. Maybe she has never experienced selfless love - does that make her evil for recreating the only kind of love she's known? No, I don't think it does. I think it makes her human.

I think part of my issue with people's discussions regarding Mary, her shooting of Sherlock, her selfish need to protect her relationship with John through lies, etc etc etc is that they are all viewing it very black and white. People are not black and white; motivations are never straight forward and people make bad choices. Mary's choices are more catastrophic than most, but it still boils down to her making choices based on fear and a past we know nothing about. 

So many TV characters are one- or two-dimensional and I love that Moftiss put so much effort into creating complex, well rounded, royally screwed up characters in this show.


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I dislike being outnumbered. It makes for too much stupid in the room

http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_mdmfsd8LI11rs9hrro1_400.gif
 

February 23, 2014 11:12 pm  #35


Re: My thoughts about Mary (all episodes)

LoveIsAViciousMotivator wrote:

RavenMorganLeigh wrote:

But...erm, the character Mary is a creation of the writers. That means she is what they wanted her to be. She can't independently up and decide to be a great person and then be mad that the writers didn't portray her that way... she is the way she is because the writers wrote her that way, and that is what fans are responding to. http://cdn.boardhost.com/emoticons/confused.png
 So, I don't quite understand what you mean...

I don't understand how you can't understand what I said there. I know she is a creation of the writers. No where did I say that this character is magically this. What I said in my post was that I believe the writers made a mistake in not showing us moments of geniune affection from John and Mary, especially the wedding scenes. 

The writers seem to tell us Mary loves John and John loves Mary. I just wish we were shown more rather than told. That's all.
 
 

But the writers chose not to show us moments of genuine affection; unless you are arguing that they are incompetent then the logical conclusion is that they didn't intend us to see it because they knew perfectly well that the genuine affection did not exist.

John may love Mary, but Mary loves herself first and foremost; she may have a possessive and obsessive desire for John, but it isn't love as I understand it.  ACD wrote a number of stories about such emotions; the Sussex Vampire and Thor Bridge are obvious examples which highlight this in canon.

I share SusiGo's view of Sherlock's behaviour in Baker St; Mary is exceedingly dangerous. That is why Sherlock's 'Tell Mary she's safe now' at Appledore works for me; a Mary who feels threatened will kill without compunction, whereas a Mary who believes she is safe is far less likely to leave a trail of corpses in her wake...
 

 

February 23, 2014 11:12 pm  #36


Re: My thoughts about Mary (all episodes)

Wholocked wrote:

I also feel that her character is quite complex and that's what I enjoy about her. I love the character of Mary; not because I think she's a good person but I think she's a very human person. I think the writers have done a brilliant job of creating a character that has multiple motivations (as most people do); who is carrying around baggage from a difficult past and is making decisions based on that baggage (as most people do). She's not a caricature or a stereotype and I personally think that's brilliant.

Some people have expressed the view that they felt betrayed by Moftiss and Mary's character because they were "made to love her" in the first two episodes only to learn that she's "not who they thought she was" in episode three. I love that fact. I think it is a beautiful demonstration that people are not two dimensional and that people make mistakes. I agree that most of her motivations are selfish - but without knowing exactly what has happened in her past, it's impossible to make any kind of judgements as to whether that is justified. Maybe she has never experienced selfless love - does that make her evil for recreating the only kind of love she's known? No, I don't think it does. I think it makes her human.

I think part of my issue with people's discussions regarding Mary, her shooting of Sherlock, her selfish need to protect her relationship with John through lies, etc etc etc is that they are all viewing it very black and white. People are not black and white; motivations are never straight forward and people make bad choices. Mary's choices are more catastrophic than most, but it still boils down to her making choices based on fear and a past we know nothing about. 

So many TV characters are one- or two-dimensional and I love that Moftiss put so much effort into creating complex, well rounded, royally screwed up characters in this show.

I agree with you! =DDD
 

 

February 23, 2014 11:28 pm  #37


Re: My thoughts about Mary (all episodes)

Wholocked

I doubt that many people can understand what motivates people who kill for money; Moftiss made quite sure that there is no get out route along the lines of 'she did it for her country', or 'she did it because she was attacked'. They deliberately made her someone alien to most of us; I can imagine myself killing someone for a number of reasons, but I can't imagine that.

Moftiss have no intention of allowing a character to upstage Sherlock, and they have no intention of overturning conventional morality beyond the point of no return. A TV show with a psychopathic hero has already been done, and they have no intention of looking as if they are trying to rewrite Dexter with a baby

That doesn't leave much scope for the character...

 

February 23, 2014 11:47 pm  #38


Re: My thoughts about Mary (all episodes)

Willow wrote:

Wholocked

I doubt that many people can understand what motivates people who kill for money; Moftiss made quite sure that there is no get out route along the lines of 'she did it for her country', or 'she did it because she was attacked'. They deliberately made her someone alien to most of us; I can imagine myself killing someone for a number of reasons, but I can't imagine that.

Moftiss have no intention of allowing a character to upstage Sherlock, and they have no intention of overturning conventional morality beyond the point of no return. A TV show with a psychopathic hero has already been done, and they have no intention of looking as if they are trying to rewrite Dexter with a baby

That doesn't leave much scope for the character...

Actually, you and I are thinking along the same lines, I think-- and Dexter did have the family and the baby-- and none of that worked out well for him in the end. He was a serial killer-- and when he tried to be "normal", "human"-- the effect was charming for awhile, and then, inevitably became lethal and tragic for those he loved. I thought it was interesting that near the end of the show, it's pointed out that he loves his sister -- but his love is about what she gives him-- she makes him feel real, good about himself-- he doesn't love her just about her, for herself. He cannot love unselfishly. 

There's a parallel here. 

So, again-- nobody's saying that Mary cannot love-- but her love is narcissitic and I think we may find out later, deadly. 

 

 

February 24, 2014 12:35 am  #39


Re: My thoughts about Mary (all episodes)

RavenMorganLeigh wrote:

Willow wrote:

Wholocked

I doubt that many people can understand what motivates people who kill for money; Moftiss made quite sure that there is no get out route along the lines of 'she did it for her country', or 'she did it because she was attacked'. They deliberately made her someone alien to most of us; I can imagine myself killing someone for a number of reasons, but I can't imagine that.

Moftiss have no intention of allowing a character to upstage Sherlock, and they have no intention of overturning conventional morality beyond the point of no return. A TV show with a psychopathic hero has already been done, and they have no intention of looking as if they are trying to rewrite Dexter with a baby

That doesn't leave much scope for the character...

Actually, you and I are thinking along the same lines, I think-- and Dexter did have the family and the baby-- and none of that worked out well for him in the end. He was a serial killer-- and when he tried to be "normal", "human"-- the effect was charming for awhile, and then, inevitably became lethal and tragic for those he loved. I thought it was interesting that near the end of the show, it's pointed out that he loves his sister -- but his love is about what she gives him-- she makes him feel real, good about himself-- he doesn't love her just about her, for herself. He cannot love unselfishly. 

There's a parallel here. 

So, again-- nobody's saying that Mary cannot love-- but her love is narcissitic and I think we may find out later, deadly. 

 

I think I mentioned elsewhere that, if John had a pet rabbit, I wouldn't have have given much for its chances of survival should John have decided that he simply couldn't carry on with Mary; Sherlock may well have felt the same thing about John's chances of survival in that event.

And as you note, vis a vis Dexter, giving people a baby and a family doesn't fix a psychopath; in the end it brings down Götterdämmerung where everybody suffers...

 

 

February 24, 2014 12:45 am  #40


Re: My thoughts about Mary (all episodes)

Willow wrote:

RavenMorganLeigh wrote:

Willow wrote:

Wholocked

I doubt that many people can understand what motivates people who kill for money; Moftiss made quite sure that there is no get out route along the lines of 'she did it for her country', or 'she did it because she was attacked'. They deliberately made her someone alien to most of us; I can imagine myself killing someone for a number of reasons, but I can't imagine that.

Moftiss have no intention of allowing a character to upstage Sherlock, and they have no intention of overturning conventional morality beyond the point of no return. A TV show with a psychopathic hero has already been done, and they have no intention of looking as if they are trying to rewrite Dexter with a baby

That doesn't leave much scope for the character...

Actually, you and I are thinking along the same lines, I think-- and Dexter did have the family and the baby-- and none of that worked out well for him in the end. He was a serial killer-- and when he tried to be "normal", "human"-- the effect was charming for awhile, and then, inevitably became lethal and tragic for those he loved. I thought it was interesting that near the end of the show, it's pointed out that he loves his sister -- but his love is about what she gives him-- she makes him feel real, good about himself-- he doesn't love her just about her, for herself. He cannot love unselfishly. 

There's a parallel here. 

So, again-- nobody's saying that Mary cannot love-- but her love is narcissitic and I think we may find out later, deadly. 

 

I think I mentioned elsewhere that, if John had a pet rabbit, I wouldn't have have given much for its chances of survival should John have decided that he simply couldn't carry on with Mary; Sherlock may well have felt the same thing about John's chances of survival in that event.

And as you note, vis a vis Dexter, giving people a baby and a family doesn't fix a psychopath; in the end it brings down Götterdämmerung where everybody suffers...

 

Now you've got me wondering if this is the conflict that the writers used quite knowingly when writing Mary's character arc; we ( the viewers) *want the myth* that love redeems all, love is all you need, love solves everything--- 


Dexter's character arc ends with him realizing that *he's* what's wrong." It's a theme that they repeat throughout the show-- he is what's wrong. 

With Mary, you've got the beginnings of that same trope; we build up the idea that the character can be redeemed "by the love of a good man", and they may tear that all down come season 4 or 5. 

Weird thing that ocurred to me; "The love of a good man (or woman) is often what some idiots have said when trying to "cure" someone's gayness. Hmmmmm.....

Nice Fatal Attraction referrence. :-)

Last edited by RavenMorganLeigh (February 24, 2014 12:47 am)

 

Board footera

 

Powered by Boardhost. Create a Free Forum