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August 12, 2012 11:00 am  #1


Stop Calling Sherlock a Sociopath! Thanks, a Psychologist.

Thought I would start a separate thread rather than insert this into an ongoing discussion.

http://io9.com/5933869/stop-calling-sherlock-a-sociopath-thanks-a-psychologist


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August 12, 2012 11:38 am  #2


Re: Stop Calling Sherlock a Sociopath! Thanks, a Psychologist.

Ah, clever marketing at work here.

The writer of this is jumping on the bandwagon to be sure. She has a book coming out in January, "Mastermind: How to Think Like Sherlock Holmes ". How original.
No fictional character is more renowned for his powers of thought and observation than Sherlock Holmes. But is his extraordinary intellect merely a gift of fiction, or can we learn to cultivate these abilities ourselves, to improve our lives at work and at home?
We can, says psychologist and journalist Maria Konnikova, and in Mastermind she shows us how. Beginning with the “brain attic" —Holmes’s metaphor for how we store information and organize knowledge—Konnikova unpacks the mental strategies that lead to clearer thinking and deeper insights. Drawing on twenty-first-century neuroscience and psychology, Mastermind explores Holmes’s unique methods of ever-present mindfulness, astute observation, and logical deduction. In doing so, it shows how each of us, with some self-awareness and a little practice, can employ these same methods to sharpen our perceptions, solve difficult problems, and enhance our creative powers. For Holmes aficionados and casual readers alike, Konnikova reveals how the world’s most keen-eyed detective can serve as an unparalleled guide to upgrading the mind.


Hee hee, "Brain Attic". I wonder how many more of these names will come out of the woodwork before the end of this year?

Her first debunking - She starts by misquoting the show "Do your research," his Holmes urges. "Don't call a person a psychopath when what he really is is a sociopath."

Then tells us Sociopaths & psychopaths are the same thing. This is a highly debatable statement; even her quoted source for the diagnostic tool, Robert Hare acknowledges there is a difference. So we'll use an expert's opinion for one thing but not the other. Hmmm

The subject of Sociopath Vs Psychopath has been done before in here so I won't go down that road.

I do however agree with her on many other points.
Yeah sure Sherlock has some traits but the main one for me has always been her first ; he wouldn't admit that he was one if he was.

But this DOES fit in with a modern day adaptation. People everywhere are starting to self diagnose themselves in a similar manner. Because a SMALL percentage of patients with sociopathy, psychopathy or other personality disorders have shown signs of ultra high intelligence, the common belief is that they go hand in hand. Hence why people self diagnose this way.
Reality sucks; almost will find they are merely 'normal' with over active imaginations, lol.

Anyway, back to the article. Some things have some grounding but she is rather selective in which facts to use & which to ignore.
But as a preamble to releasing a book on Holmes (which appears to be the kind that has been done over & over again) I guess it will attract a few 'interested bystanders' who will eventually quote her as gospel on all thing Holmes, lol.

My final analysis : I'll pop her in the drawer with the other bandwagoners - I'm not convinced she's got anything more to add than the average fan.


____________________________________________________________________________________________
Also, please note that sentences can also end in full stops. The exclamation mark can be overused.
Sherlock Holmes 28 March 13:08

Mycroft’s popularity doesn’t surprise me at all. He is, after all, incredibly beautiful, clever and well-dressed. And beautiful. Did I mention that?
--Mark Gatiss

"I know that you believe you understand what you think I said, but I’m not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant."
Robert McCloskey
 

August 12, 2012 6:49 pm  #3


Re: Stop Calling Sherlock a Sociopath! Thanks, a Psychologist.

Speaking of books like this, I checked out Success Secrets of Sherlock Holmes from the library, which was fairly entertaining, but not that helpful. Most people who have read the stories could have figured most of those things out, lol.

Too many people are trying to market "Think/Be Like Sherlock Holmes" books, when in reality not many of them are very effective or good. You could read one and get the basic gist of them all.

Last edited by Smoggy_London_Air (August 12, 2012 6:49 pm)


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Initials SH and proud owner of a viola named Watson.

Potential flatmates should know the worst about each other.

It's a three patch problem.

I didn't know; I saw.
 

August 13, 2012 12:55 am  #4


Re: Stop Calling Sherlock a Sociopath! Thanks, a Psychologist.

Smoggy_London_Air wrote:

Speaking of books like this, I checked out Success Secrets of Sherlock Holmes from the library, which was fairly entertaining, but not that helpful. Most people who have read the stories could have figured most of those things out, lol.

Too many people are trying to market "Think/Be Like Sherlock Holmes" books, when in reality not many of them are very effective or good. You could read one and get the basic gist of them all.

Thanks for letting me know that. There is always a danger that I might miss an actually good book on this subject by refusing to buy/read/acknowledge any of them, but to date that hasn't happened.

People need to understand, NOT everyone will 'get' Sherlock's way of thinking, try as they might. Now that doesn't make them any less intelligent than anyone else. People simply think in different ways. It has NOTHING to do with intelligence whatsoever.
Whilst you can hone 'what you have in your head', what you have is what you have. And what is intelligence worth these days? Lesser intelligent people can use computers to 'tap into' a great wealth of intelligence anyway.
A more valuable asset is common sense.

But again I digress.
Yes smoggy, this appears to be yet again another bandwagoner. Problem is it will be 'easy money' as they've hit on a show that's popular with the mainstream consumers who are more likely to buy anything & everything just because of the name on it. You only have to look at say, the sales of those silly little magnifying glasses that Sherlock used. They've been around for years & suddenly they have doubled in price & are selling like hot cakes. People really will buy anything these days.

*rolls eyes@consumerism*


____________________________________________________________________________________________
Also, please note that sentences can also end in full stops. The exclamation mark can be overused.
Sherlock Holmes 28 March 13:08

Mycroft’s popularity doesn’t surprise me at all. He is, after all, incredibly beautiful, clever and well-dressed. And beautiful. Did I mention that?
--Mark Gatiss

"I know that you believe you understand what you think I said, but I’m not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant."
Robert McCloskey
 

August 13, 2012 1:35 am  #5


Re: Stop Calling Sherlock a Sociopath! Thanks, a Psychologist.

kazza474 wrote:

Smoggy_London_Air wrote:

Speaking of books like this, I checked out Success Secrets of Sherlock Holmes from the library, which was fairly entertaining, but not that helpful. Most people who have read the stories could have figured most of those things out, lol.

Too many people are trying to market "Think/Be Like Sherlock Holmes" books, when in reality not many of them are very effective or good. You could read one and get the basic gist of them all.

Thanks for letting me know that. There is always a danger that I might miss an actually good book on this subject by refusing to buy/read/acknowledge any of them, but to date that hasn't happened.

People need to understand, NOT everyone will 'get' Sherlock's way of thinking, try as they might. Now that doesn't make them any less intelligent than anyone else. People simply think in different ways. It has NOTHING to do with intelligence whatsoever.
Whilst you can hone 'what you have in your head', what you have is what you have. And what is intelligence worth these days? Lesser intelligent people can use computers to 'tap into' a great wealth of intelligence anyway.
A more valuable asset is common sense.

But again I digress.
Yes smoggy, this appears to be yet again another bandwagoner. Problem is it will be 'easy money' as they've hit on a show that's popular with the mainstream consumers who are more likely to buy anything & everything just because of the name on it. You only have to look at say, the sales of those silly little magnifying glasses that Sherlock used. They've been around for years & suddenly they have doubled in price & are selling like hot cakes. People really will buy anything these days.

*rolls eyes@consumerism*

I went through a self-help books phase last summer (bored, of course, what else is new?) and I can say with great conviction that none of them actually improved my quality of life. Perhaps I just don't have the right sort of personality, but honestly none of them seemed very helpful, and most of them only impart information that most people already have access to, either online or from psychologists and friends.

The one thing Sherlock Holmes in general, especially the series, helped me with was accept that when people called me "intensely analytical," it was, in fact a compliment. I never viewed it as such.

That is the problem with the bandwagon. I remember when I first read The Hunger Games, way back in 2008, there wasn't much merchandise aside from the obscure t-shirt it took three weeks to track down and a few bookmarks in Borders (RIP, Borders.  ) Then the movie came out and BOOM, merchandise everywhere. I think the less merchandise, the better. It increases creative drive in fans. So far there haven't been many problems with Sherlock, and most merchandise is designed by fans. I'm holding my breath for it though, and all these books seem to be just the beginning. I pray it stays low-key.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Initials SH and proud owner of a viola named Watson.

Potential flatmates should know the worst about each other.

It's a three patch problem.

I didn't know; I saw.
 

August 13, 2012 1:52 am  #6


Re: Stop Calling Sherlock a Sociopath! Thanks, a Psychologist.

Smoggy_London_Air wrote:

I went through a self-help books phase last summer (bored, of course, what else is new?) and I can say with great conviction that none of them actually improved my quality of life. Perhaps I just don't have the right sort of personality, but honestly none of them seemed very helpful, and most of them only impart information that most people already have access to, either online or from psychologists and friends.

I resisted the urge to use this word before, but as you seemed to have strengthened the case for it I shall. I actually find these types of books insulting to my intelligence. Now not everyone will feel that way, because MY intelligence is not YOUR intelligence. Again that doesn't make either person MORE intelligent. It may well be that the majority of people find the books helpful by giving them prompts. It may well be that some people find them amusing. And it may well be that some people believe they are great doorstops. I don't don't believe they will be great anythings & hence won't buy them, lol.

But again, good luck to her, she might manage to release the book a little later & catch the next wave of Sherlockism with season 3!


____________________________________________________________________________________________
Also, please note that sentences can also end in full stops. The exclamation mark can be overused.
Sherlock Holmes 28 March 13:08

Mycroft’s popularity doesn’t surprise me at all. He is, after all, incredibly beautiful, clever and well-dressed. And beautiful. Did I mention that?
--Mark Gatiss

"I know that you believe you understand what you think I said, but I’m not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant."
Robert McCloskey
 

August 13, 2012 2:18 am  #7


Re: Stop Calling Sherlock a Sociopath! Thanks, a Psychologist.

kazza474 wrote:

I resisted the urge to use this word before, but as you seemed to have strengthened the case for it I shall. I actually find these types of books insulting to my intelligence. Now not everyone will feel that way, because MY intelligence is not YOUR intelligence. Again that doesn't make either person MORE intelligent. It may well be that the majority of people find the books helpful by giving them prompts. It may well be that some people find them amusing. And it may well be that some people believe they are great doorstops. I don't don't believe they will be great anythings & hence won't buy them, lol.

But again, good luck to her, she might manage to release the book a little later & catch the next wave of Sherlockism with season 3!

I agree for the most part. I feel as if you're stuck in a 9-5 job that you hate and your life seems to be going nowhere, reading a self-help book or two might help you. This doesn't seem to apply to you, kazza. In my opinion, the vast majority of the population in my country, and probably most developed countries, could seriously use that kind of wake-up call.

For intelligent people, it's an entirely different story. Books like The Secret, 7 Secrets of Highly Effective People, Achieve Anything in Just One Year, etc., are for the masses. Of course Sherlock wouldn't read anything like these: he is already a highly effective person, knows how to achieve his goals (in fact, already has), and is generally satisfied with his life, (because no self-help book can ensure that the Yard is continually flummoxed). The problem is that the kinds of people that read books with titles like "How to Think Like Sherlock Holmes" probably already aren't the people who will get things done by thinking like Sherlock.

Insulting? In many ways. Consumable for 90% of the population? Probably.

Last edited by Smoggy_London_Air (August 13, 2012 2:19 am)


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Initials SH and proud owner of a viola named Watson.

Potential flatmates should know the worst about each other.

It's a three patch problem.

I didn't know; I saw.
 

August 13, 2012 7:19 pm  #8


Re: Stop Calling Sherlock a Sociopath! Thanks, a Psychologist.

Back to the original post:

By pure coincidence, I've just read a passage in a Jo Nesbo"s The Devil's Star (Harry Hole book) that happens to touch on this. A psychologist comes in to explain serial killers to the police detectives and very pointedly says there is a difference between a psychopath and a sociopath. The passage is quite long, but here's part of it: "The psychopath is often a maladjusted individual without a job, without any aducation, with a crininal record and a variety of social problems.  Unlike the sociopath, who is intelligent, apparently successful and living a normal life."

Of course, a label is a label, not the thing itself.  And the book is fiction, unlike Sherlock, which is real.

 

August 13, 2012 7:27 pm  #9


Re: Stop Calling Sherlock a Sociopath! Thanks, a Psychologist.

veecee wrote:

And the book is fiction, unlike Sherlock, which is real.


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"To fake the death of one sibling may be regarded as a misfortune; to fake the death of both looks like carelessness." Oscar Wilde about Mycroft Holmes

"It is what it is says love." (Erich Fried)

“Enjoy the journey of life and not just the endgame. I’m also a great believer in treating others as you would like to be treated.” (Benedict Cumberbatch)



 
 

August 13, 2012 8:01 pm  #10


Re: Stop Calling Sherlock a Sociopath! Thanks, a Psychologist.

I've read a couple of these "Be Like Sherlock" type books now, and so far haven't found one that actually tells you HOW to do things, they just tell you WHAT to do and for the most part it's really obvious stuff like:

Be more observant.

I'm like, "yes I know that, but HOW?!"


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August 13, 2012 9:35 pm  #11


Re: Stop Calling Sherlock a Sociopath! Thanks, a Psychologist.

I noticed the book, but it didn't really interest me. It is simply the agent's marketing machine in action.


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     Thread Starter
 

August 14, 2012 12:07 am  #12


Re: Stop Calling Sherlock a Sociopath! Thanks, a Psychologist.

lol, let's imagine a world where one could actually learn to be like Sherlock from a book.. now, wouldn't that be a fascinating world indeed.

For the matter, it is similar difficult to read about how to become a screenwriter like Gattis and Moffat. The basics are covered but beyond.. ?

Who would have thought it is that challenging to become a genius?

 

August 14, 2012 3:54 am  #13


Re: Stop Calling Sherlock a Sociopath! Thanks, a Psychologist.

@The Doctor You probably summed up my whole opinion in that first sentence of yours. The idea is that practice makes perfect, and this was touched on in one of those books I read. (Only quality piece of advice in the whole book if you ask my opinion). What was said was something along these lines: any genius/ultra-successful person will spend 10,000 hours practicing whatever it is that they do, no matter how much natural talent one has, before they become a true genius at their profession.

Seems plausible, although there must be variables if you're gifted at one thing or another. If I keep practicing Mycroft at this rate I have another...oh, 15 years.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Initials SH and proud owner of a viola named Watson.

Potential flatmates should know the worst about each other.

It's a three patch problem.

I didn't know; I saw.
 

August 14, 2012 4:53 am  #14


Re: Stop Calling Sherlock a Sociopath! Thanks, a Psychologist.

Ok, that's it I am going to write a book.

" Mind Palacing on a Budget" aka "Instant Sherlock on a Shoestring"



Chapter 1
Google is your friend, Wiki is your God.
So you haven't yet got what it takes to be a genius? Never fear, stick close to your computer/laptop/smart phone at all times & have the Google search page at your fingertips.
Want to sound impressive & knowledgeable with facts & dates to back up anything you say? Then that is when you look to your new God, Wiki.





How's it look so far? lol


____________________________________________________________________________________________
Also, please note that sentences can also end in full stops. The exclamation mark can be overused.
Sherlock Holmes 28 March 13:08

Mycroft’s popularity doesn’t surprise me at all. He is, after all, incredibly beautiful, clever and well-dressed. And beautiful. Did I mention that?
--Mark Gatiss

"I know that you believe you understand what you think I said, but I’m not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant."
Robert McCloskey
 

August 14, 2012 8:14 am  #15


Re: Stop Calling Sherlock a Sociopath! Thanks, a Psychologist.

Quite nice, Kazza, but how will you make a book from it? Everything said in 3 lines. 
Now go on and write 200 pages of empty phrases around it - and: there you are!


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"After all this time?" "Always."
Good bye, Lord Rickman of the Alan
 

August 14, 2012 10:32 am  #16


Re: Stop Calling Sherlock a Sociopath! Thanks, a Psychologist.

kazza474 wrote:

Ok, that's it I am going to write a book.

" Mind Palacing on a Budget" aka "Instant Sherlock on a Shoestring"



Chapter 1
Google is your friend, Wiki is your God.
So you haven't yet got what it takes to be a genius? Never fear, stick close to your computer/laptop/smart phone at all times & have the Google search page at your fingertips.
Want to sound impressive & knowledgeable with facts & dates to back up anything you say? Then that is when you look to your new God, Wiki.





How's it look so far? lol

Sounds very promising, I think you have just discovered a hidden talent...

Even before Wiki and Google, we had a phrase here: "Intelligenz ist wissen wo's steht" - which loosely translates into "Intelligence is knowing where to look it up".


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"There is no such word as 'impossible' in my dictionary. In fact, everything between 'herring' and 'marmalade' seems to be missing." Dirk Gently

Finally, I have made it to Cipher Expert :-))))) (8.8.2012)
 

August 14, 2012 11:23 am  #17


Re: Stop Calling Sherlock a Sociopath! Thanks, a Psychologist.

Perhaps my first comment/gentle nudge escaped you, this thread is not to question or comment on the credentials of the author. In the 'real world' most authors don't even get to have a say in their book covers so I can imagine how little say they have in an online campaign. Please stick to the point of the thread or comment elsewhere.


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     Thread Starter
 

August 14, 2012 1:19 pm  #18


Re: Stop Calling Sherlock a Sociopath! Thanks, a Psychologist.

Having read the whole article by the psychiatrist author I agree with her assessment that Sherlock is not a sociopath (or psychopath if you are inclined to view them as two separate conditions). There is a clear link to the thread about Asperger's syndrome which also resides in this section of the forum.


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Don't make people into heroes John. Heroes don't exist and if they did I wouldn't be one of them.
 

August 14, 2012 7:12 pm  #19


Re: Stop Calling Sherlock a Sociopath! Thanks, a Psychologist.

I must say that Sherlock's mind palace has curb appeal.

I believe that's "kerb" in the UK. Do you use the phrase "kerb appeal"?

 

August 14, 2012 8:03 pm  #20


Re: Stop Calling Sherlock a Sociopath! Thanks, a Psychologist.

We do. It is usually used by Estate Agents (Realtors) for houses that look good from the street. Curb is something different.



Yes we use curb as in to stop or check something like enthusiasm.

Last edited by Davina (August 15, 2012 5:16 am)


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Don't make people into heroes John. Heroes don't exist and if they did I wouldn't be one of them.
 

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